Indications of a Strong Beginning

This story appears on VirtueOnline:

Six ACA bishops headed to Ordinariate
TAC Archbishop: Six bishops, 61 priests and 29 congregations will join up

A VOL EXCLUSIVE

By Mary Ann Mueller
Special Correspondent
www.virtueonline.org
Feb. 14, 2011

Archbishop John Hepworth, the Primate of the Australian-based Traditional Anglican Communion (TAC), and its American branch — the Anglican Church in America (ACA) — has announced that six ACA bishops are strongly considering joining the Anglican Ordinariate once it becomes established on this side of the Atlantic.

"We have six bishops and 61 ACA priests who have put in dossiers applying to be clergy of the Ordinariate, and 29 parishes have voted and indicated to Cardinal Donald Wuerl that they have voted from the ACA into the Ordinariate," said Hepworth.

The ACA House of Bishops has a census of 10 including Bishop Juan Garcia of Puerto Rico. Earlier this month three ACA bishops communicated to VOL that they are unwilling to be a part of the developing Ordinariate. They include: Bishop Brian Marsh, Diocese of the Northeast; Bishop Stephen Strawn, Diocese of the Missouri Valley; and Bishop Daren Williams, Diocese of the West.

"We are not going to Rome. We have chosen to stay together, to remain with the ACA," the three bishops emphatically stated in a VOL Exclusive. "With regard to the dioceses of the Northeast, Missouri Valley and West, we should advise you that these dioceses will remain with the Anglican Church in America."

The six US bishops are: Louis Falk, the President of the ACA House of Bishops and the retired bishop of the Diocese of the Missouri Valley, and the first Primate of the Traditional Anglican Communion; David Moyer, the Bishop-in-Charge of the Patrimony of the Primate and Bishop of the Armed Forces; Louis Campese, the Bishop of the Pro-diocese of the Holy Family and the resigned bishop of the Diocese of the Eastern United States; George Langberg, retired Bishop of the Diocese of the Northeast; Welborne Hudson, retired Bishop of the Armed Forces; and James Stewart, retired Bishop of the West.

Archbishop Hepworth also noted in a recent e-mail to VOL that ACA Bishop Juan Garcia, Bishop of Puerto Rico, is also interested in the Ordinariate. But since, unlike The Episcopal Church, the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops does not extend past US borders, the Puerto Rican bishop will have to become a part of a Caribbean Ordinariate when and if it is established.

Father Scott Hurd, Cardinal Wuerl's liaison to the Catholic Conference of Bishops ad hoc committee for the Ordinariate told VOL, from his office in Washington, DC, that the current status of the American Ordinariate is that the ball is now back in the Vatican's court.

"It's public knowledge that we have concluded the information gathering stage," Fr. Hurd noted. "That information has been communicated to the CDF (Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith) in Rome. They are the decision making agency. So in a sense the ball is in the CDF's court."

It is now up to Cardinal William Levada to decide the next step in the erection of an American Ordinariate.

"It is the CDF's decision. I think conditions are very favorable for the establishment of an Ordinariate in the United States," Fr. Hurd noted. "Things in England have been happening with great rapidity. One can hope that things will be processed quickly for the United States as well."

Archbishop Hepworth willingly acknowledges that there will be an ACA remnant remaining once the Ordinariate is established.

"I think enviably [sic] there will be an ACA which remains," the Archbishop said, although he doesn't know what shape the American church or the TAC will take in post-Ordinariate Anglicanism.

I find lots to be encouraged about in the details of this story — not only the numbers which are quoted, but also the statements by Fr. Hurd, all help give the picture of just how healthy the beginning will be for the U. S. Ordinariate.  Add to that the Anglican Use parishes and the groups coming in from TEC, and it's even more encouraging.

* * *

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About Fr. Christopher Phillips

Fr. Christopher G. Phillips is the pastor of Our Lady of the Atonement Catholic Church in San Antonio, Texas, where he has served for the past twenty-eight years. He is the founding pastor of the first Anglican Use parish, erected in 1983 under the terms of the Pastoral Provision. Fr. Phillips was ordained as an Anglican for the Diocese of Bristol, England, in 1975. After serving as Curate for three years at St. Stephen Southmead, he returned to the United States and served in two Episcopal parishes in the Diocese of Rhode Island. In 1981 he left the Episcopal Church and moved with his family to Texas, where he was subsequently ordained as a Catholic priest in 1983. Fr. Phillips and his wife, JoAnn, have been married for forty years. They have five children, all grown and married, and three grandchildren.

49 thoughts on “Indications of a Strong Beginning

  1. I am glad a previous report has been corrected on Virtue. As I stated there, and in a previous post on this site,

    The following comment by Mr. Virtue on his website and my response.
    "As far as who is interested in an Ordinariate the list is indeed small and includes Moyer, Campese and a handful of parishes. The list is certainly not long. We will know more in time."

    I invite all to go to theanglocatholic.com and link unto 'Moving Forward'. As you scroll down you will come to a link to a google map. There you will find an up to date list of parishes, missions, groupings, etc. who have the intent of entering the Ordinariate once established. This does not include other groups who are considering/leaning towards the Ordinariate nor like minded individuals. Also look at the latest communication from ++Hepworth where more numbers are presented ie 6 bishops in the US.

  2. It is always refreshing to read your joyful and optimistic posts, Father. I do think that there has been enough seeking dark clouds in silver linings in others' commentary recently, around this and related blogs. Reality is messy, but if that were sufficient reason to be discouraged in life, we'd all live in a state of perpetual clinical depression.

  3. Neither +Strawn or +Williams would have any function in the Ordinariate even if they wanted to be there. Do not know about +Marsh. Have always been impressed that although +Hepworth also could not function without a major exception being made has always worked tirelessly for the erection of the Ordinariate. Perhaps we have the rather rare case of a Bishop who cares more for principle than self. Good for him.

    1. Curius,

      You said: Neither +Strawn or +Williams would have any function in the Ordinariate even if they wanted to be there.

      Why not, and how do you know this?

      But it might explain their opposition….

      You wrote: Have always been impressed that although +Hepworth also could not function without a major exception being made has always worked tirelessly for the erection of the Ordinariate.

      Although he cannot serve an ordinariate without an indult or a dispensation, he could return to his former diocese or order if reconciled.

      Norm.

  4. At risk of being accused of ignorance, could someone please clear up a point I have been pondering over for a while: How is it possible for for Bishop Moyer to hold office in more than one denomination? Not being au fait with the canons and constitutions of the denominations involved, I find this an interesting phenomenon, and would dearly love to better understand the ramifications. Thanks so much.

  5. Interesting to note that although the current bishops of three ACA dioceses are not planning to join the Ordinariate, the retired bishops of each diocese are planning to do so – so there is at least one bishop resident in each ACA diocese coming into the Ordinariate – along with some of its flagship parishes, such as St. Mary of the Angels, Hollywood, and Cathedral of the Incarnation in Orlando. Falk, Stewart and Langberg are experienced clergymen, who've been involved in the TAC for a long time. Langberg was President of the House of Bishops for a while, before stepping down to do an advanced degree in ecumenism.

    Even from a completely worldly point of view, I would say that those who are most experienced and qualified are going with the Ordinariate, even if they will loose some of their power and authority. But in another way, I'd say that their willingness to embrace unity in this way is precisely why they are qualified – it is the sign of leadership, of putting the ultimate good of the church ahead of what seems to be right at the time.

    You can have an independent denomination, your own canon law, your own titles, bishoprics – everything liturgical or doctrinal exactly the way you like it. Or you can have an ecclesial life that really and truly expresses the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. You can risk laying down titles, ministry – the totality of your life and being. Or you can play it safe.

    The Son did not ask what of his power, authority or rank he would be able to exercise when He became Man, but he humbled himself. He did not ask what his rights would be. Rather, He simply laid himself down, and looked to lose Himself in worship of his Father, and sacrifice Himself for the redemption of the world. There was no question of strategy, no issues of procedure, no matters of law – no ecclesiastical niceties. He looked deliberately to share pain, humiliation and degradation. He wanted to die for us.

    There have been times in the history of the Church where, perhaps, most unfortunately, an argument might be made that it was necessary to go against the authority of Patriarchs – perhaps even, for the sake of argument – the Pope himself. Or even if wrong, you might say that, in going against the Vatican, people like Luther or Calvin were taking the harder path, being willing to lay themselves down for what they thought was right.

    But how many Christians in the West today, even the most Protestant, could seriously say that becoming a Catholic in communion with Rome is not the hardest path in today's world? Surely the Pope has done more to stick his neck out for the Gospel than any other Christian leader. He is the most public defender of Christian orthodoxy, basic morality and decency. He stands for the Church, for the Christian Faith – and his See is, in so many instances, the only ministry in the world standing between humanity and a Godless secular future – certainly the only real force in Europe.

    Perhaps in America, in a place that is almost drowning in churches, most conceived in the passion of petty splits and childish squabbles, it is difficult to imagine just how secular, how far from God so much of the Western world is… As a Canadian, anything that keeps any Christians who actually believe in the Creed from working together as closely as possible, in an actual visible united body – a family, sharing sacraments, and with common pastors – is Anathema. We've lost too many babies to abortion, to many teenagers to suicide, too many couples to mindless sex.

    I am sick to death of the word "patrimony", tired of debates about liturgical minutiae, bored to tears at questions of canon law, and angry at anything that would detract from the call to mutual submission and service, or distract from the task of evangelism – and indeed of saving our own souls.

    1. Michael,

      Thank you for a very well written, thoughtful, insightful, and thought provoking comment. There are a lot of congregations across all Christian deonminations that would benefit immensely from hearing their pastor read your post as a Sunday sermon.

      I am sick to death of the word "patrimony", tired of debates about liturgical minutiae, bored to tears at questions of canon law, and angry at anything that would detract from the call to mutual submission and service, or distract from the task of evangelism – and indeed of saving our own souls.

      There's no doubt that the proclamation of the gospel for the salvation of souls should be paramount for all of us.

      Nonetheless, the other issues that you identified are not insignificant. They are the heart of how we pray together and how we relate to one another in good order — that is, the heart of the very "mutual submission and service" that you seek.

      Of course, those issues never should become a source of division.

      Norm.

  6. One of the many strengths that Bishop Moyer has, is his devotion to being a true shepherd living the Gospel.
    He will surely respond should you wish to send him an email about his role in two jurisdictions.
    We in the TTAC are fortunate to have him as our Episcopal Visitor, with Bishop Robert Mercer CR having his permission to act in his name, here in the UK.

    1. I have no doubt in my mind at all that +Moyer is an exceptionally devoted shepherd. I need to understand how it is canonicaly possible to operate across denominational borders. The way I understand canonical obedience is that no person could "dance at two weddings, or sit on two chairs at the same time" to quote a Jewish proverb.

      1. I'm assuming that you're asking why Bp. Moyer is still Rector of an Episcopal parish. All I can say in response is that there have been lots of things happening in the Episcopal Diocese of Pennsylvania that are, canonically speaking, pretty strange. :-)

        There are lots of cases where a priest or bishop in one jurisdiction is permitted to function in another. Or looking back through the history of the church, there are cases (especially during the Arian heresy or other schisms) where there were multiple bishops claiming authority in one area, where there might have been several "denominations" present, to use our modern terminology.

        The point is, that isn't supposed to be the situation. In seeking to come under the authority of the Bishop of Rome, +Moyer is working towards the best possible solution to our unity problems: the ministry of Peter.

        1. Shouldn't Dr. Moyer make a public explanation of his simultaneous role as an ECUSA rector, a Central African priest, and a TAC bishop, in order to assure the faithful that he is, in fact, "working towards the best possible solution to our unity problems: the ministry of Peter," rather than asking him privately? I think it is rather odd to suggest otherwise, given the concerns oft stated here that too much has gone on behind closed doors in the TAC/Ordinariate negotiations thus far. I might also suggest that some explanation of the extensive legal battles at Rosemont might be in order.

          1. brian,

            You wrote: Shouldn't Dr. Moyer make a public explanation of his simultaneous role as an ECUSA rector, a Central African priest, and a TAC bishop, in order to assure the faithful that he is, in fact, "working towards the best possible solution to our unity problems: the ministry of Peter," rather than asking him privately? I think it is rather odd to suggest otherwise, given the concerns oft stated here that too much has gone on behind closed doors in the TAC/Ordinariate negotiations thus far. I might also suggest that some explanation of the extensive legal battles at Rosemont might be in order.

            How, exactly does the fact that Bishop Moyer wears hats of two or three denominations affect any of us? This is a matter that's strictly between him and the authorities of the denominations that he is now serving.

            Of course, such a situation clearl will not persist if he enters the Catholic Church because the Catholic Church will not tolerate it.

            Norm.

            1. I apologise for being a pain in the butt, BUT the question uppermost in my mind is: Where is +Moyer leading his people to, Rome, ECUSA or TAC? It is a question of the courage of one's conviction. If Rome is the chosen path, why not renounce ECUSA? I am certain that there is a perfectly simple and logical explanation that would quell many an anxiety.

            2. "Just a dumb girl,"

              You wrote: I apologise for being a pain in the butt, BUT the question uppermost in my mind is: Where is +Moyer leading his people to, Rome, ECUSA or TAC? It is a question of the courage of one's conviction. If Rome is the chosen path, why not renounce ECUSA? I am certain that there is a perfectly simple and logical explanation that would quell many an anxiety.

              AFAIK, the public announcement said that he will join the ordinariate. I think we should accept that announcement at its face value unless there's definitive information indicating otherwise.

              Until he actually is accepted for the ordinariate and begins the transiation, the man as to subsist somehow. If the Traditional Anglican Church (TAC) and The Episcopal Church (TEC) are content with the fact that he is ministering in both bodies until he moves into the ordinariate, that is their concern — not ours. He will not be able to retain either of his current positions if he enters the Catholic Church.

              BTW, TEC dropped the former "Episcopal Church – U. S. A." ("ECUSA") name and acronym a couple years ago in favor of its current name and acronym.

              Norm.

  7. Father Phillips, God bless you for your hopeful spirit and for sharing it with us! …like oil on troubled waters…a balm in Gilead.

    ——–

    (I wish the negativity-mongers, all of them, especially on sites like this that were originally intended toward optimism, would just shut it.)

  8. What possible purpose (other than curiosity) would be served by rehashing old lawsuits and going over canons of jurisdictions that very soon will be part of the distant past? Rosemont legal battles and the question of who's been doing what in which jurisdiction is of little consequence or interest at this stage of things.

    There is no need for Bishop Moyer to give anyone any further assurances of his dedication to the implementation of Anglicanorum coetibus. His own hard work speaks clearly enough. As I have come to know him better, it's obvious that he is a man striving for holiness, and one who will continue to serve God's people faithfully in the Ordinariate.

    I really don't see the need to pick at scabs, nor do I have any fascination for what might be under the out-house.

    1. That is your prerogative, Father, and I respect your judgment. All of us who are well-wishers for the Ordinariate want to see it erected with a minimum of controversy or logistical difficulty. This will not only require canonical iregularities and legal difficulties to be resolved; it will require forthrightness and integrity on the part of everyone charged with bringing the Ordinariate into being, at every level, in the spirit of 1 Timothy 3. I hardly think it is "picking at scabs" to suggest that Dr. Moyer might be well served in speaking publicly on the resolution of his local difficulties, which have themselves been made public by Dr. Virtue, so that there are no unnecessary roadblocks to the implementation of the Ordinariate in the future.

      1. The reason for my raising a query regarding the provisions/loopholes contained in either canons or constitutions of the denominations involved is precisely because it would not be in the best interests of the wider TAC to be penalised/criticized by the CDF for being procedurally incorrect by virtue of the perception that an individual might have a situation that could be construed as a conflict of interests. I have no doubt in my mind that the bishop is doing a sterling job and is a devoted shepherd. This is, however, not about the person, but the technicalities of the situation.

        1. There is no indication whatsoever that TAC has been penalized or criticized by the CDF. In fact, the CDF makes it a point to stay out of the internecine affairs of Anglicanism or any other ecclesial body.

          Your insistent questions and comments about this non-issue lead me to believe that you have a more personal interest in the matter.

  9. brian,

    You wrote: I hardly think it is "picking at scabs" to suggest that Dr. Moyer might be well served in speaking publicly on the resolution of his local difficulties, which have themselves been made public by Dr. Virtue, so that there are no unnecessary roadblocks to the implementation of the Ordinariate in the future.

    How do you know that the situation poses the "local difficulties" that you assert?

    >> Is there any reason to believe that Bishop Moyer has not been forthright with the proverbial "powers that be" of the Anglican Church in America (ACA), the Traditional Anglican Communion (TAC), The Episcopal Church (TEC), and the Catholic Church regarding his status and plans?

    >> Is there any reason to believe that his pastoral ministry for TEC is not an interim arrangement and that the respective TEC diocese has not already planned for either a newly ordained presbyter or a presbyter returning from a leave of absence to take over the parish before he will enter the full communion of the Catholic Church?

    This is a case of Dr. Virtue butting into a matter that is none of his or her business, probably in the hope of causing disruptions. We ought not feed into it.

    Norm.

    1. David Virtue is 100% against the Ordinariate and actively works with those who wish to harm it. It is extremely difficult to find a positive article on the Oridinariate within Virtue on Line. VOL gives the likes of Fr. Hart free reign to say anything and to promote his scree of Rome lies and the Pope needs to repent to the one true church know as the Anglican Catholic Church.

      So like most good reporters, David Virtue slants his articles to promote his agenda. TEC bad, Rome bad. I have been watching and reading VOL since 2009. My impression of VOL after 3 years of research.

      So it David Virtue can find something negative to say or find someone with something negative to say about the Ordinariate…..he will post it. And repeat it. He actively repeated mis-information about the ACA situation as he gets it from Ordinariate naysayers. When his hand is forced, he may contact those in favor of the Ordinariate.

      1. Norm, I would have to agree with you on the tone of the stories on VOL. Partiucarly irksome to me was a recent article by one Robin G. Jordan, who blames the anglo-catholics for later departures from Catholic fatih and order — a stretch!

  10. Everybody,

    Just to clarify one point in the original article, which said: Archbishop Hepworth also noted in a recent e-mail to VOL that ACA Bishop Juan Garcia, Bishop of Puerto Rico, is also interested in the Ordinariate. But since, unlike The Episcopal Church, the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops does not extend past US borders, the Puerto Rican bishop will have to become a part of a Caribbean Ordinariate when and if it is established.

    The Conferencia Episcopal Puertorriqueña (C.E.P.) is separate from the Antilles Episcopal Conference (AEC) which, in spite of its name, encompasses Suriname, Guyana, Belize, the "ABC Islands" (Aruba, Bonaire, and Curacao), and Bermuda in addition to the islands of the Lesser Antilles and Jamaica. Thus, the truth is that the Puerto Rican bishop, clergy, and parishes of the Anglican Church in America (ACA) will have to become part of a Puerto Rican ordinariate.

    IIRC, Archbishop Hepworth's pastoral update of 30 November 2010 indicated that the Puerto Rican bishop would ask for the erection of an ordinariate for Puerto Rico, but the ordinariates for the Australia and then for the United States and Canada seem to be next in the queue based on the information that I have seen so far.

    Norm.

  11. It is not true that the members of the TAC in Puerto Rico [and Central America] will have to become part of a Caribbean ordinaraite; in fact, P.R. has its own separate episcopal conference–separate from that of the Caribbean and not only separate from that of the U.S.A.

    But, such as a group in Scotland can belong to the Ordinariate for England and Wales, and just as a group in Japan can be part of the Ordinariate for Australia, it follows that groups in P.R. and Central American can be part of the Ordinariate for the U.S.A. The American *territory* for an Ordinariate is confined to the area of the U.S. episcopal conference but persons and property outside the U.S.A. can belong. However, outside the U.S.A., any expansion into new dioceses would require the permission of the local bishop where the expansion was planned, that's all.

    P.K.T.P.

    1. What are the complicatons and implications of the majority of the South American clergy and laity having been baptised in the Catholic Church as infants and joining a TAC affiliated church in later life? Would the numbers in this instance be sufficient to justify an Ordinariate?

      1. Well … according to the complementary norms to AC, para 5-1. neen baptized as catholic renders one inelegible to full membership into the Ordinariate (but not to worship there), unless there are familiar links. There and probably other canonical loopholes, as IIRC one of the former bishops of the CoE -I think Fr Broadhurst- is in this case.
        As much as I would love to see spanish (and portuguese) speaking Ordinariates, this would be the minor trouble. On one hand ¿how many former priests now married?, on the other, the Church in South/Central America still hasn't totally recovered from the Liberation Theology years …

        And on a lighter side of this questions. What if there were a community at Gibraltar ? For those unaware, the Catholic bishop of Gibraltar is considered member of both English and Spanish episcopal conferences

        1. asshurr,

          You wrote: And on a lighter side of this questions. What if there were a community at Gibraltar ? For those unaware, the Catholic bishop of Gibraltar is considered member of both English and Spanish episcopal conferences

          This is bizarre. The Bishop of Gibraltar and the Apostolic Prefect of the Falkland Islands appear on the list of the Department of International Affairs, but NOT on the list of members, on the web site of the Conference of Catholic Bishops of England and Wales. The Diocese of Grenada also does not appear on the list of dioceses on the web site of the episcopal conference of Spain.

          So apparently the Bishop of Gibraltar is not a full member of either episcopal conference, but collaborates with both on various matters.

          Incidentally, I found a web page with links to the web sites of episcopal conferences by country, most of which seem to work.

          Norm.

      2. "Just a dumb girl,"

        What are the complicatons and implications of the majority of the South American clergy and laity having been baptised in the Catholic Church as infants and joining a TAC affiliated church in later life?

        The Vatican will review each case individually. Fr. John Broadhurst was baptized in the Catholic Church but incardinated into the Personal Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham, but he was basically raised in the Church of England from early childhood. This indicates that the Vatican probably will accept those whose parents made the switch while they were children, but it probably will be more inclined not to accept those who left the Catholic Church as adults.

        That said, I don't know how many bishops' conferences there are in South America or which countries they serve. I'm pretty sure that there's an episcopal conference for Brazil, and I know that Suriname, Guyana, and Belize are part of the episcopal conference for the Antilles.

        As to numbers, bear in mind that an "ordinariate" can morph to accommodate many different situations. Its "chancery" could be as small as the ordinary and perhaps an administrative assistant, and it could have as few as perhaps six to eight parishes and ten to twelve presbyters. At the other extreme, the former Military Ordinariate for the United States became one of the four largest dioceses in the United States when the Vatican reconstituted it as the Archciocese for the Military Services of the United States in 1984.

        Norm.

    2. Peter,

      You wrote: But, such as a group in Scotland can belong to the Ordinariate for England and Wales, and just as a group in Japan can be part of the Ordinariate for Australia…

      The Vatican has not approved that as yet, and I doubt that it will.

      Norm.

      1. Dear Norm:

        Well I know that it will. Consider what has already been said on this by TAC Abp. Hepworth and Bsp. Entwistle regarding Japan and by the General Secretary of the Bishops' Conference of England and Wales regarding Scotland. Then consider the decision made in 2005 by the P.C.E.D. regarding membership in the personal Apostolic Administration of St. John-Mary Vianney for those living outside its territory. Also consider the fact that, when the personal Apostolic Administration of St. John-Mary Vianney was founded in 2002, Rome allowed it to keep those subjects and territory outside its designated territory that it had at the time of regularisation (viz. in the Dioceses of Niteroi and Volta Redonda). Are you familiar with Canon 372.2?

        I note that the four TAC communities of the Missionary Diocese of Central America are spread over the four episcopal conferences for Mexico, Guatemala, Nicaragua and El Salvador. The Episcopal Conference for the Caribbean is separate from those in each country in Central America (with the sole exception of Belize). Puerto Rico also has five or six dioceses now and its own *separate* episcopal conference. Obviously, there cannot be five Anglican ordinariates to cover Mexico, Guatemala, Nicarague, El Salvador and Puerto Rico. And Puerto Rico can not be in some future Ordinariate for Central America because P.R., again is not in the territory of the Caribbean episcopal conference.

        There is almost zero doubt about it: any groups of interested Anglicans in Scotland will become members of the Ordinariate for England and Wales; the TAC in Japan will become part of the Australian Ordinariate, and so forth. In time, some of these main gain their own ordinariates but they do not have the support needed for that at present.

        P.K.T.P.

        1. Peter,

          I have read Archbishop Hepworth's statement about the group in Japan very carefully. The Archbishop said that the parishes of the Traditional Anglican Communion (TAC) in Japan are "involved in" the process for Australia. He stopped short of saying that they will become part of the Australian ordinariate.

          I think that the Vatican probably is considering what to do for territories of episcopal conferences that don't have enough Anglican groups to form an ordinariate. In reply to a more recent article, another poster suggested the idea of a "pro-ordinariate" — and I find that to be a very interesting option for the reasons that I remarked in that thread. As envisioned there, the respective diocesan bishops would provide primary oversight and would have responsibility for assigning pastors, who would be incardinated into the diocese, but the "pro-ordinary" — who could be either the senior of the pastors by date of installation or the ordinary of a neighboring ordinariate — would oversee matters of Anglican liturgy and patrimony and would have some role in the episcopal conference. Such a "pro-ordinariate" clearly could be as small as one parish.

          The situation in countries in which there are too few Anglican parishes and clergy who would enter the Catholic Church to form an ordinariate will require a change in the law set forth in Anglicanorum coetibus in any case. There's no doubt that the present law, set forth in Anglicanorum coetibus, does not allow an ordinariate to erect parishes beyond its territory.

          Norm.

          1. Peter & Norm,

            While Puerto Rico and Latin America would logically be associated with the American Ordinariate through whatever legal formula may be created, do you not think that the Caribbean would find a better fit in being connected to the Canadian Ordinariate? I am not aware of any current groups of Anglicans in the Caribbean who are actively considering joining an ordinariate but presumably if they emerge they will be in the Commonwealth countries of the region, which share a cultural, historical, political and legal heritage with Canada to a greater extent than they do with the United States. I would suspect that their Anglican traditions would therefore also be more akin to those in Canada, recognising as I do that they would, of course, have much in common with Anglicans in any part of the world, and in particular with those in England and Wales, and could therefore be connected with any ordinariate. But the combination of affinity and geography would make Canada the better partner I think.

            1. Garry,

              You asked: While Puerto Rico and Latin America would logically be associated with the American Ordinariate through whatever legal formula may be created, do you not think that the Caribbean would find a better fit in being connected to the Canadian Ordinariate?

              Being realistic, I don't expect any of these connections because the explicit wording of Anglicanorum coetibus excludes them.

              Now, taking a look at the situations that you mention, there is not a single answer.

              >> I anticipate that the Conference of Bishops of the Antilles will have enough parishes to form an ordinariate, though there's little doubt that it will be one of the smaller ordinariates. Remember that the territory of this conference encompasses not only the Lesser Antilles, but also the Turks and Caicos, the Bahamas, Bermuda, and the countries of Suriname, Guyana, and Belize on the continent.

              >> I also anticipate that there will be an ordinariate in Puerto Rico, as Bishop John Hepworth, primate of the Traditional Anglican Communion (TAC), stated in his pastoral communication of 30 November 2010 that the TAC bishop in Puerto Rico would petition for an ordinariate there. This ordinariate also may be very small, but it will be an ordinariate nonetheless.

              >> The erection of ordinariates for the rest of the parishes of TAC in South America would be much more difficult, as they seem to be mostly isolated in the territories of different episcopal conferences. It's certainly possible that the Vatican might decide, by way of exeption to erect an ordinariate that spans the territory of several episcopal conferences, but the more likely accommodation seems to be something like the present "Anglican Use" within the respective dioceses where they happen to be.

              I'll be stunned if the Vatican does not do something to welcome those who want to come, but it may take a while to figure out the solution.

              But again, that's just my best effort to read the poverbial tea leaves. I might be misreading them totally.

              Norm.

  12. j.a.d.girl, you wrote, "BUT the question uppermost in my mind is: Where is +Moyer leading his people to, Rome, ECUSA or TAC? It is a question of the courage of one's conviction. If Rome is the chosen path, why not renounce ECUSA?"
    Where does that question come from? I haven't heard anyone question Bishop Moyer's goal for his people. He has declared his intention, and he is working to bring as many as possible into the Ordinariate with him. I have been a guest in his rectory and have spoken to his parish about this very issue. In all the time I have been associated with him, he has never waivered in this, so I don't know where your question comes from.

    1. No Fr Philips, I doubt that anyone is questioning +Moyer's goal for his people.
      I certainly am not.

      Like with all of us, there is Life before TAC, then ………………..THE TAC and hopfully there will be Life after TAC.

      BUT, it sounds to me, and please, I am no scholar of canon law, like being asked for your hand in marriage, only to come to the altar and find that your beau is still legally married to another.

      +Moyer is being used in a very important role, i.e. as the gatherer of TAC souls into the Patrimony of the Primate.

      As I said before, I am certain that there is a perfectly acceptable answer to the question of why it is possible to function in different denominations and hold licences from the relevant authorities, canonically.

      I am in no way criticizing, just asking for the appropriate information.

      1. Surely, Mrs. Gill, it would be a more economical use of your time and efforts to inquire of your husband concerning these matters, as he was, until recently, a bishop in the TAC. Did he, by the way, sign the documents at the Portsmouth Synod in October 2007?

        1. An honest question deserves an honest answer. Therefore Prof Tighe, I'd like to state: I asked my husband, he does not have the answer to my question either.

          My husband is not a former TAC Bishop, he is the Bishop for Southern Africa and Pretoria in the TAC.

          Maybe you would be willing to enlighten me on my original question. I really am only trying to understand the intricacies of the canons.

  13. Due to the fracturing of Anglicanism, and lets stay away from the reasons for now, many priests find themselves serving mulitple jurisdictions.

    I am, for now, a Reformed Episcopal Priest. The REC is a member of Anglican Church North America. I am a REC and ACNA priest. The REC maintains its own seperate from ACNA College of Bishops. We have are dipping a toe in ACNA and routine is it for me to hear we can leave anything we feel the need. And no I can't just walk into a member or associate jurisdiction to serve. At one time I added AMiA during a mission plant.
    So at one time, this lowly priest in Pensacola was a priest in AMiA, REC and ACNA. All at the same time. All different jurisdictions with different goals. AMiA has since pulled out of ACNA. For various reasons, some are even theological.

    Again, due to the mess of Anglicanism, the score card of jurisdictions changes constantly. +Iker of Fort Worth is a Bishop in ACNA and the Southern Cone. Two different jurisdictions. I could name many Anglican Bishops who are sitting Bishops in various Anglican Colleges. +Iker sits in two colleges that offically do not recognize each other. ACNA has not been offically recognized by Canturbury and most Anglican groups.

    Anglicans routinely move priests around. CoE priests who serve TEC or ACNA parishs while still CoE. All this to say, what the degree of interest in +Moyer? He is doing nothing outside the norms of Anglicanism.

    Our Catholic brothers may not understand and possibly be shocked at what I have written. This is normative for Anglicanism in the last 30 years and especially the last 10 as Anglicanism fractures more and more.

  14. I hope I can provide the honest answer that has been requested concerning the ecclesial status of Bishop Moyer. He was deposed from the clergy of the TEC by Bishop Bennison, and lost the court case that followed. He is therefore not in any way a clergyman of the TEC. He has remained as parish priest in a parish whose buildings are part of the TEC. His parish intends to join the US Ordinariate. At this time, he is a bishop in good standing in the TAC. The Patrimony of the Primate in the US has been accepted until the past two weeks by all the bishops of the ACA, the US province of the TAC. There is now some contesting in the ACA of the status of bishops and clergy in the Patrimony (a strictly temporary device until the Ordinariate is erected). It should be appreciated that in the highly belligerent environment of TEC, it has not always been wise to signal one's intentions too soon. As a frequent visitor to Good Shepherd, and Bishop Moyer's consecrator, I have never been in any doubt about his ecclesial position. But it has been wise to keep the TEC in doubt. Fortunately, the Ordinariate is regarded as a more honest destination than ACNA by some of the belligerents, and the situation for very brave people such as we find at Rosemont is becoming a little better. In short, he is leading his people to the Ordinariate as part of the TAC contingent. And he is doing the same in England as Episcopal Visitor to the TAC there.

    1. Thank you Father,

      The faithful in the Patrimony of the Primate deserve a smooth passage down the Via Appia.

      Regards to you and your family,

      Dalene

  15. God bless you, Your Grace, for your servant leadership of theTAC during this time. Soon, at least in Roman time, the thing will be done, and all those who have managed to climb aboard the Barque of Peter will find the warmest welcome (much warmer than one would have predicted even a few years ago), much peace, and many opportunities for fruitful labor in the Lord's vineyard.

  16. Bishop Juan Garcia has been the Bishop of Puerto Rico in ACA since 1997. He has been one of my dearest friends and we communicate frequently. His consecration took place in a Catholic Cathedral and he has been on good terms with Catholic clergy since before that time. He has had many conferences with the various Catholic bishops in Puerto Rico and the relationships have been very cordial. “Next time come and spend the night — and be sure to bring your wife!” is what he hears in a typical invitation. The Archbishop of San Juan personally carried a request for the formation of an Anglican Ordinariate to CDF early last fall. Bishop Garcia has played a wise and enthusiastic part in the House of Bishops of ACA. His interests in the Mainland are natural for more sons and daughters of Puerto Rico are closer to the banks of the Hudson than the banks of the Caribbean. His choice of a Bishops’ Council would be in Puerto Rico, where the Catholic bishops have already loaned him buildings as well as welcoming him as a future “diocese.”

    Fr. Tom

  17. I am struck by the extent to which the chaos of Anglicanism threatens to disorient us all. The constant battles of the past years continues still, as battles about real estate, which "flavor" or "flavors" of Anglicanism from which one proceeds. Many of us have clung to various pieces of the wreckage as we seek to weather the storm.

    Could we not recall that when the Spirit of God moved in creation, out of chaos came order? Is this not part of the Ordinatiate's claim on us — it offers to bring order.

    Can not the Holy Father's generosity move us to gracious acceptance of one another? As the ordinariate is erected here, I expect the Church's response to all of us with our personal and ecclesiastical irregularities will be as generous and healing as is the Apostolic Constitution itself.

    Dean+

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