So I'm back from the studio in Austin, home in San Antonio. I often wonder how much good can be done by taking part in these magazine-style news programs. Trying to cram three or four important issues into an hour (breaking for commercials, of course!), isn't a terribly effective way of discussing something. Unfortunately, our society is more comfortable with sound bites rather than thought-provoking conversation, so I guess that explains the popularity of this kind of program. I think I'm going to make a hard and fast rule: I'll speak only to interviewers who can pronounce "Anglicanorum coetibus." Only kidding. But I was surprised that Raymond, who usually is so well-prepared and even fastidious in his style, stumbled… and stumbled… and stumbled again. Finally I had to say it: "Let me pronounce it for you." I hope I didn't use a superior tone of voice, but honestly! I was afraid that by the time we got the document's name out, there'd be no time for anything else!
Our topic was cheated out of three minutes — the telephone lines in Washington went haywire, so we were cut short. When I spoke to the producer afterwards, I opined that perhaps Nancy Pelosi was burning up the phone lines trying to marshal her troops. At any rate, even in the short time we had, I hope a little bit of useful information got out. It's awfully difficult to speak in a sensible and orderly way when program hosts take call-in questions from viewers. In all the years I've been going on programs like this, there are always people who call in with "agenda questions." You heard some of them this evening. "Will these Anglicans believe in papal infallibility?" asked by someone who probably thinks we're a bunch of protestants infiltrating the Church with our fingers crossed. And then the question about married priests "abstaining from the marital embrace," which I can only describe as prurient.
I hope I was able to communicate something helpful about the clergy and people who perhaps wouldn't be joining an Ordinariate immediately. Of course, my personal hope and prayer is that everyone will want to enter immediately, but it's important for people to respect the pastoral sensibilities involved.
We'll have another chance to put out more information, because I've been invited by Marcus Grodi to be on his hour-long program later in April. I know his last program on this topic was less than satisfying, but I'm hoping to be able to repair some of that by going on as his guest. I won't be there to talk about myself, my conversion experience, or our parish. I'm going there to talk about Anglicanorum coetibus. And I'll make sure he can pronounce it before we go on the air.
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Dear Father,
I understand your wondering about whether or not this type of interview is worthwhile. I was recently contacted by the local newspaper about the "breaking news out of Orlando" (this almost two weeks since the news "broke").
We all do our best to get the most information out in the short time we are allotted and within the sound bites that they want from us. I am sure you did an admirable job and am glad that you were chosen to be the spokesman for Anglican—ummm-or—-or—ummm, uh Cohabitibus—co-educate, er, ummm, well, you know.
Father, your tongue-twisted attempt qualfies you for your own prime-time news show!
Fr Phillips, you did more than fine with both the time given and the less than interesting questions phoned/e-mailed in. Not to mention the technical difficulties at the end. I understand the level of ignorance about the Apostolic constitution that is out. This whole event has caught everyone, including many of us, off guard. Yet, in your responses you were both gracious, informative, and above all truthful. Let us pray you have once again served to get folks interested in becoming better informed, in spite of the bombardment of front page exaggerations from the media. Gracias Fr. Phillips.
I look forward to your presentation this coming April.
I was very surprised also that Raymond was not very knowledgeable about the subject. He is usually very articulate and knows the subject very well. It goes to show you that very few people, except the ones involved in the Ordinariate are either not informed or very ill informed.
I thought Fr. Phillips did a very good job with the short time he had and some of the interruptions when he was explaining some of the details.
You are right about the last Grodi programme. The expert he interviewed seemed to have walked straight out of Damian Thompson's blog. I very much look forward to your corrective.
RE: 1stcomment, second paragraph
ROFL!!!
Raymond apparently hadn't read your blog beforehand. He was still reporting about the number of ACA parishes that had converted, and seemed stunned when he was corrected. I guess he had been relying upon the Catholic News Agency for his information, which turned out to be a mistake for him.
I don't think the comment on abstinence was so much due to being prurient, but more likely from an understanding of a tradition of continence prior to celebrating the Divine Liturgy. I'm not altogether sure whether or not the Orthodox Church (or Eastern Rites) still requires some period of abstinence or not. Wikipedia provides some background in their article on clerical celibacy.
With all the questions that might be asked about Anglicanorum coetibus, is the matter of the marital discipline of the clergy among the most pressing? I think not.
Following on from Father Phillips statement about everything falling into place upon the erection of an Ordinariate, I was wondering just how the initial Ordinary and Governing Council of an Ordinariate is to be chosen, since AC and the complementary norms provide that the Governing Council provides a terna of three names from which the Holy See chooses one to be the Ordinary. If the whole set up with priests and Governing Council is not yet in place, does this mean that Holy See will appoint a temporary Ordinary or Apostolic Vicar initially until the whole thing is up and running? As a lawyer, I am curious that the AC does not spell out initial transitional arrangements. Does anyone have any idea how this will work in practice? I guess we will know once we have the first document erecting an ordinariate by the CDF.
Father Phillips wrote:
"…I hope I was able to communicate something helpful about the clergy and people who perhaps wouldn’t be joining an Ordinariate immediately…."
These folks need our prayers for certain. They have been, since 2007 in a jurisdiction that has an official position on the Catechism of the Catholic Church as articulated by our Bishops:
"We accept that the most complete and authentic expression and application of the Catholic faith in this moment of time is found in the Catechism of the Catholic Church and its Compendium, which we have signed, together with this letter as attesting to the faith we aspire to teach and hold."
This same Catechism of the Catholic Church, is the standard for the Ordinariates.
For them to stay "without the gate" places them in a rather interesting position, and particularly so if they choose to stay there long term, with reference to the theological approach to the Catholic Faith that has been normative in their jurisdictions for going on three years.
Does a future denial of the teaching of the Church come into play for them?
In the Apostolic Constitution FIDEI DEPOSITUM, the Venerable Servant of God, John Paul II wrote:
GUARDING THE DEPOSIT OF FAITH IS THE MISSION WHICH THE LORD ENTRUSTED TO HIS CHURCH, AND WHICH SHE FULFILLS IN EVERY AGE.
Those of us heading toward the Ordinariates, once established, look forwarding to doing our small part in helping to carry out this task.
I am not sure how emotionally and rationally, someone currently in the ACA, can turn their back on the Church's teaching to simply stay "without the gate."
I am reminded that those to whom much has been given will much be required, and I certainly pray for anyone who can not lay aside their personal inclinations and "what they think" toward the greater grace to be found in believing in faith, what The Church teaches.
Credo! – I Believe! must be our watchword going forward, but we must also remember the wise council of Cardinal Newman, that "ten thousand difficulties, do not constitute one doubt" concerning the teaching of The Church.
Faithfully,
Sean W. Reed
Sean, I sincerely hope that all the ACA bishops will enter the Ordinariate with most, if not all of their clergy and laity. However, it may not be in the very first round for all of them. There may be some who need to see exactly how it all works. God moves in His own time.
Father –
I don't dismiss that point at all, and I do appreciate what you are saying.
I keep healthy does of Office intentions going for not only the successful implementation of the AC, but also those struggling to discern their future path.
I just fear that many of them have painted themselves into a corner if they reject the provisions of Anglicanorum Coetibus.
SWR
Your point is an important one, Sean. My hope and prayer is that the ultimate decision will be to "come home."
I see the discussion has been on Bishops, Clergy and laity within the ACA, in the States. What about clergy not in the ACA or TAC? Does that clergyman move into the ACA then to the Ordinariate or straight into the ordinariate when it is organized? Under whose oversight? How is he examined? By the ACA or the ordinariate?
I believe a transfer into the ACA would be practical? Then moving into the ordinariate. I am in the process of leaving my current jurisdiction, though it may not be a transfer, but a charge of abandoning the communion. Just trying to figure out how the landing will be as the take off maybe quiet bumpy.
Fr. Mark, I'm quite certain that when an Ordinary is appointed you (and those in a similar situation) would make application directly to him. There would be no need to go through ACA at that point. Judging from the telephone calls I receive, there will be many clergy like you who will make application to move directly into the Ordinariate.
Fr. Mark,
I agree heartily with Fr. Phillips in principle, but I am reading between the lines of your response and seeing the specter of a deposition in your future – something many of us have dealt with in the past. Am I correct in assuming that said action may be imminent? If so, you may not have the luxury of waiting until the Ordinariate(s) is/are set up.
My suggestion would be to follow Fr. Phillips' sage advice if the authorities are not breathing down your neck and threatening deposition for your courageous choice. If you yourself are considering leaving the ACNA, stay in place for the time-being. However. if you or your congregation are in immediate need of a jurisdiction due to canonical action on the part of the ACNA you might want to investigate coming under the godly admonition of an ACA/TAC bishop.
Would you agree, Fr. Phillips?
I agree completely, and considered suggesting that if Fr. Mark felt the need to be within the fellowship of the ACA, it might be a good thing to do; however, I reconsidered the suggestion since I don't know the procedure to do that, or what the requirements of the ACA would be. In other words, because of my ignorance, I didn't want to give questionable guidance. If Fr. Mark wants to know about this possibility, perhaps someone in the know could guide him.
One wishes that Fr. Charles Connor of the Diocese of Scranton were given his own talk show on EWTN. He seems to get Anglo-Catholicism, he has an AU parish in his Diocese, and his various series on EWTN are always of the highest intellectual standard and always edifying.
Fr. Phillips, you quite rightly stated that Permanent Deacons would not be able to transfer to the Ordinariates, because they were only open to former Anglicans.
However, in my (Roman Catholic) diocese there are 11 of us Permanent Deacons who are former Anglicans, not to mention 6 Priests. Do you know whether the exclusion would apply to us as well?
Deacon, I can't speak with any authority, of course, but I would think that those of you who were Anglicans and are now Catholic deacons, would be in the same situation as those of us in the Anglican Use, and that you would indeed be eligible for membership in an Ordinariate. It's a question you should pose to the Ordinary when he is appointed, but I can't imagine it would be answered in anything but the affirmative.
Fr., thanks for your thoughts. It did seem to me the "common sense" answer as well, but the prospect of never having to endure "Shine Jesus shine." being sung at Holy Mass again just seemed too good to be true! As you say, a question to be posed to the Ordinary if one is appointed here.